Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Hey, everyone, and welcome to Sandwich Generation Squeeze. Real conversations to support the generation squeezed between caring for children and aging parents. In today’s episode, we’re going to talk about the 2020 documentary called, “The Social Dilemma” and how social media impacts the sandwich generation squeeze. I’m Cris Roskelley, a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And I’m Dr. Dianne Kraaijvanger, a Licensed Psychologist.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: We’re supported today by Cozi Family Organizer, which is a great online shared calendar application. So stay tuned at the end of the episode for a special Cozi promo. Just for our listeners. If you’d like to learn more about the different shared calendar options available to reduce the hassle and stress of coordinating your caregiving schedule across family members, we actually have a great course on our website that you can check out at sandwichgenerationsqueeze.com.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: So the social dilemma, Cris. Remember after I watched that, I said to you, “We have to do a podcast about this!”. And for us, it was like, “OK, how will that fit into our topic? Our sandwich generation squeezed people” and it fits in so well, right? Because we’re not only talking about caregiving for the older adults in our lives, we’re also talking about what it’s like to be squeezed in between and caring for our kids. And this is all about the human impact of social networking that affects all of us.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Which is really huge. And it is such an important documentary. I loved watching it. And I’m so glad that you suggested it to me. And it really… I’ve had my own opinions about social media over the years, but I did not know a lot of what the movie covered in terms of some of the advertising impacts related to social media, which I’d love to talk about. But I think the primary thing regarding the sandwich generation squeeze is the very real link between mental health and social media use that they talked about.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Yeah, absolutely. And I thought it was a really interesting take they had that it was a documentary-drama hybrid, which I thought was kind of fun. So you actually really had the real tech experts that were sounding the alarms (like it said on the intro), on their own creations. And then you had the actors. So for me, the movie was so powerful.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And I think the listeners, every episode, they’re going to get to know us more and more. And they will soon come to find out that I am not a tech genius, to say the least.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: We have our very own digital dinosaur.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Exactly. And you are our tech guru, thank goodness. So for me, this movie, I grabbed it and I ate it up. And I think exactly what you were saying, the mental health components of this movie just really rocked me.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Well, you are. It’s been so interesting because when we started the Sandwich Generation Squeeze was kind of your entry into social media. And, you know, I got to kind of walk you through setting up a Facebook account and watching exactly what they’re talking about affect you. You know, when you were kind of wondering, how do you have so many Facebook friends?
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: And I only have this many. And oh, my gosh, look, I have more now.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: And now I feel so much better about myself and, you know, seeing like, why why are these people posting photos where everything’s great, I’m not having a good day. And it’s something that, you know, has been kind of going on for for years here. But but it was fascinating to see it again of just that kind of direct link to the impact of social media and how it makes people feel. And when we think about kids, it is really fascinating. I just want to share a few of the stats that the that the movie went over, because they’re they’re really eye opening.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: They are. They are eye opening. And, you know, when you are saying about setting up the accounts.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And when you first said that to me, remember when we were like, let’s do this podcast, we want to reach a large, large number of people, we want to be real.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: We want to have these conversations about people who are really, in my opinion, going through so much, just trying to balance everything.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And you and I have talked about this. And then when you said, “OK, Di, well, a part of that is that we have to get on Facebook, we have to get on Instagram”. And I was like, “What are you talking about?” You know, nearing 50 years old and I’m like, “No!”
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: The panic.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Tha panic. You know, I’ve stayed away from that (social media). And absolutely even at my age, just like you said when I started when I started kind of getting on here and I’m looking at everyone’s pictures for years, you know, of these pictures that people have posted.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And I’m kind of like, wow, people have done really cool stuff.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Have I done that? Have I traveled as much? There was this comparison like I haven’t experienced before.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And I think that’s why this movie I was like, “Oh, this is so good”.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: It is. Social media is really insidious. And, you know, like the movie points out, the social media I think has a lot of positives. You know, it’s it helps reconnect people like you’ve commented, you’ve got back in touch with people, and that’s really fun. And, you know, there are so many like minded communities on social media where you can form connections and have business opportunities and just connect with people, which are great. But, you know, in terms of the negatives, obviously there are a lot from the fake news and, you know, kind of that addiction. And the you know, I love the concept that they talked about that social media is basically a “digital pacifier”.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Yes, I like that, too.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Wasn’t that a great term?
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: I thought that was so great, I really did.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Where it basically takes us away from managing learning how to manage those feelings of discomfort or loneliness. And it’s kind of that immediacy that we get that satisfaction immediately where, you know, when it comes to kids, that’s a not a good thing. And so I just want to mention these stats. So they said that there has been an increase in depression and anxiety in teens since 2010, and that’s up sixty two percent in older teenage girls, 15 to 19 year olds, and up one hundred and eighty nine percent for preteen girls.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: And the same pattern holds in suicide, which is frightening that the stats are up 70 percent for older teen girls and up one hundred and fifty one percent for preteen girls. And that these stats can be directly attributed to the boom of social media, which became available on mobile platforms in 2009.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Yeah, exactly. I mean, it goes back to what Tristan Harris had said about the digital pacifier. When we are lonely, when we’re afraid, we have this digital pacifier now. It’s atrophying all of our abilities to deal with different emotions. And so then the conversation went on about. We have been involved to care about what our tribe thinks about us, but we have not been to care about what 100000 people care about us.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And so I think of young minds like these kids and when you’re talking about these numbers, you know, 10 to 14 year olds. They haven’t developed the ability to be able to parse out this. And to be quite honest, nor have I, at forty eight years old when I first joined Facebook just recently. And so, again, we’re putting this pressure on our kids.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And what does that look like and what is happening? And those numbers that you read, yeah, they’re numbers, but I hope people really listen, for the impact that we’re doing. What does it mean? This podcast in no way is saying these platforms are bad. “Don’t do it”. Not at all. We’re just saying the platforms, just like the makers of this movie, they have to be held responsible. There has to be some sense of responsibility. And so how do we use it in a way that is healthy for us? Because like Tristan Harris also said, is simultaneously utopia and dystopia.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And so that is what is fascinating about what we’re talking about.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Totally. It’s that it’s the addiction. And I think how to manage using technology in a way that is helpful and feeds your life but doesn’t become an unhealthy crutch. And, you know, it’s there was one scene in the movie where I think it was Tristan, I can’t recall, but somebody who worked in the industry was saying that he spends his day making this technology and then is a victim of it at night while he’s sitting in his closet hiding from his family and his young children, who he should be connecting with in person and is addicted to sitting there on his phone, on his social media, checking, you know, did he get an update? So did somebody friend them? Did somebody like something he said? And it’s this constant, you know, hamster wheel.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Right. Yeah, that was Tim Kendall. I think he was talking. He used to be the former Facebook executive and former president of Pinterest.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And when he said that, I thought that was an interesting part of the movie, they were all kind of telling their own stories about how “we’re the creators of this and it’s even addictive for us”, which I think humanized it on a level that I appreciated.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Totally, totally. Because, you know, I think with anything, it’s easy to to do anything too much. And so I think when it comes to the sandwich generation squeeze, we want to talk about this in that this technology is here to stay. You know, our devices are here to stay, especially now during covid. We have seen how much can actually be accomplished online and virtually.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Which I don’t think will change that much when, you know, things resume more normally. I think some fields like medicine and different things will be more virtual now.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: I mean, even my own practice, just doing telehealth. Not a surprise to our listeners, but at first when covid came and I had to do everything by telehealth, I was like, “Do I close down my practice? What do I do?” But you know, that’s what I love. I love doing the clinical work. So I said no way and I had to adjust to that. And now six, seven months later, I really like it. Do I miss sitting in my office across from people? Of course, absolutely. But there are clear benefits. And I think that’s important to note. You know, you can’t kind of throw the baby out with the bathwater, that’s for sure.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Yeah, well, I you know, I think tech is comes with many, many benefits. Again, it’s just having the tools and especially for parents learning what kind of tools can help.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Like there was a scene in the movie where they have, you know, like a cookie jar that has a timer on it in that box. And I and I know some parents who do this. I remember working with clients, you know, who we talked about different coping mechanisms. And some of them were taking the electronics away, but not putting them kind of under the jurisdiction of the parents. And I like that kind of locking it away with like, “Sorry, it’s locked for all of us and we can’t access it”. So I’m not the bad guy telling you no, this is kind of this external little device who has them locked up and at this time it will unlock for us.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And do you guys do that in your own home? Like, do you have a time where you put the devices away or that the devices can be used up until a certain point for yourself or for your daughter?
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: I am really strict on not having devices on at like at the dinner table. Or, you know, when I am sitting with my child, I have the device off so I can be present. I’m pretty good at that. I’m not great at it. If, like, something urgent is going on that I need to be paying attention to, then I definitely fall victim to that, you know, sitting there, but really not being there and being in my phone. But, you know, it’s certainly hard, like especially right now for my child being home so much during covid, you know, electronics and especially, you know, they have become a playmate and they’ve become a pretty constant way of keeping in touch with friends and connecting socially. And so my rules have definitely loosened during this time much more than I’m honestly really that comfortable with. And I kind of I keep wondering how it’s going to look when the world returns to a more normal point. And then I dropped down those laws again. Of less electronics. How that will go.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Yeah. What that will look like? You know, I always joke that my youngest has her PhD in Roblox. Because there has been a lot of device time since covid. And, you know, listen, I know other people, they probably have navigated this better than we certainly have in our household. But you know, definitely at night, I definitely have a pretty strict at night role. Like there’s no devices in the bed or in the bedroom, which has worked well for us. But the rules have relaxed, we should say, once covid came.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: But that’s why I think this movie really affected me, because when I saw those numbers that you read for those kids who are 10 to 14, that’s my youngest. And I absolutely do see a difference in her take in the world. And her, I guess, fear, I guess, for taking more chances. It was interesting because they were saying, yes, you know, that social psychologist who was saying those numbers from NYU, he was saying that kids are more anxious, are more fragile, they’re more depressed and they are less comfortable with taking risks. Which obviously we know like that’s what kids are supposed to do, right? Take risks. And I see this certainly in my youngest sometimes is needing to be perfect. And where is that coming from? The influence (of social media)?
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Yeah, and that’s fascinating because I was around a group of ten year olds fairly recently, pre-covid, and they had just found Tik Tok with the filters that you can put on.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: And they were having a blast with it for about an hour and then one of them walked away and literally said. I seeing myself on there looking like that is fun, but then it kind of makes me feel bad because I think I look better on there than I really do. For a 10 year old first of all, to be able to voice that I thought was so wise. But that is that what they called “Snapchat dysmorphia” in the movie where they were talking about how some kids actually want surgery so they can look more like they do in their filtered selfies.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: And that is just a tragedy to me. It makes me so angry. And, you know, I mean, with the rise of I mean, not the rise, the existence of eating disorders and the pressure on girls and boys, you know, it’s that’s just such a dangerous slippery slope for social media.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And I think that was one part of the movie that I kind of took away for myself, is that, you know, these platforms, they’re not designed to protect children and they kind of take over some of the self-worth and identity for sure. You know, one of the speakers, it looked like he was in a presentation, was talking and he said, you know, we conflate “likes” with value, but ultimately this leaves us more vacant and empty than before we did it.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: All right, it’s time for our halftime show where we’re going to answer an audience question. So here we go. Cam asks, “My mom was in a facility and we have been unhappy with her care, so we’ve decided to move her into our home. She does require a higher level of care and we will have medical professionals that will come and assist. What specific items should I get for her arrival to make her more comfortable?”
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: So Cam, thank you so much for your question. So this is a hard question in one way, because obviously we don’t have the specifics of your mom and her needs, but we’re going to give a generalized list of things to have on hand that might be really helpful. So because she is a higher level of care, like you were saying, I always suggest for bathing, if you have a bathroom on the first floor, that is easy and accessible, I always… When I had my parents with us, I always put in a bucket everything that I would need. So I would have the soap and I’d have the shampoo and brushes and everything else there in one centralized location. That way, if you are helping or one of the people that you have in the home that will be helping to take care of showers, everything is there and you don’t have to be running in and out of the bathroom for safety.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Another thing that is helpful possibly is a small heater to have in whatever room she’s staying or a ceiling fan to make the room more comfortable. Certainly a chair with arms can be helpful at the dinner table. I know my for my father, he had COPD and had a hard time kind of getting around and wasn’t mobile. So those arms really helped him to kind of get up. And we also bought him a recliner. It was like a La-Z-Boy recliner, although I must admit, he didn’t use it as much as I wanted him to. He already had a favorite chair in the room.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: But anything that can help assist mobility is a helpful thing.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Also depends on her skin, sometimes there is skin breakdown. So you want to have a good skin care regime for them. So whether it’s nice lotions that you have or ointments that spread easily and can clean off easily for any of that fragile skin that can tear. A wipe warmer is actually really nice. Again, just so the wipes that you use on your skin isn’t cold to the touch, which might be nice. And I found it very helpful to have a pill organizer for all of their meds.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: So if you have, sometimes they’ll have it and you can buy it anywhere, but a seven day a week pill organizer. And that way every day you don’t have to think about the pills.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: The nurse that comes in can fill them and then you’re able to dispense them. An important thing is a go bag. And so it has a set of everything that you need in there. And sometimes depending on the mobility, again, we’re not really sure from the question, but you might have a gate belt which will help to kind of stabilize your mom. It’s a belt that you put around her waist when she’s walking. And you can you hold on to the back of it. Just to kind of stabilize her for balance. And the last but not least is an adjustable bed. And we have a great blog article on this. If you go to the sandwichgenerationsqueeze.com.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: That’s such a great list. And one other thing I wanted to add is it can be really helpful to layer the bed. And one technique is to basically have a mattress cover over the mattress.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: And then on top of that, put what’s called a chuk pad, and that’s basically a disposable incontinence pad that you can throw away. And on top of that, another fitted sheet and then another chux pad and then a second fitted sheet and then follow that up with a top sheet. And it can be helpful to have the top sheet and the fitted sheet in different colors so she can easily tell the difference between them in dim lighting. So I hope that that list was helpful. And if anyone would like to submit a question for our half time show or suggest a future topic, you can just head over to our website at sandwichgenerationsqueeze.com.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: It’s scares me for the young people, like they were saying that, you know, Generation Z, those kids born after nineteen ninety six, are really the first generation who are growing up with social media. They’re now in middle school. And like you said, this, the stats that they are seeing in terms of anxiety and depression and what you mentioned that is very fascinating to me on an intellectual level.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: But a tragedy in real life is that that risk aversion that you mentioned.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Yeah. You know, and just that need to be to strive for perfection.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: And I mean, think about I mean, this has been going on in a very microcosm for girls for a very, very long time. Looking at magazines and wanting to look like celebrities and, you know, all of that. But now when it is hit from them on all angles. It’s very concerning and in addition to the the online bullying, you know, that is inherent in social media that the the movie didn’t really cover, but that we have certainly seen a lot in our own practices. When kid are posting pictures of their parties and things that others weren’t included on or they create that bullying mentality that has led to so many tragic suicides and it really is a very concerning trend.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Yeah, absolutely. And I think, you know, a concerning trend, like you said, for certainly the younger generation, but for all of us as a whole, there’s so much polarization that’s going on.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And the movie did talk about kind of the political polarization, the US political polarization. It’s at an all time high.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: It is so strongly steeped that these two sides no longer trust each other. It’s about total division. You know, one of the speakers had said, you know, democracy is completely for sale. You know, it’s to create these culture wars and you don’t have to look too far.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: You know, it had talked about Myanmar and the destruction and their opinion that it did over there, not only in their opinion, the facts of what happened over there and how platforms are just able to spread information, whether it’s fake or not. And again, this isn’t us saying “everybody don’t go on any of these platforms”. This is just a conversation about at what time do people, the people, the users…just like the quote said, there’s only two kind of categories that use the word ‘users’, and it’s oftentimes with people with addiction issues or the internet. But when the users have a voice more than these huge platforms do. So it’s just about holding the platforms responsible.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: It’s about trying not to make it all about money, but you know, about human needs.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Yeah, I agree. And I’m the first to say I actually use social media and I’m really only on Facebook, but I am definitely prone to, you know, the nightly scroll. I will crawl in bed and just start scrolling on Facebook and reading the news and seeing what friends are up to. And by friends, I mean the person I met once 10 years ago that I’m friended with on Facebook. And it is addicting. I mean, I just continue to scroll and scroll scroll. And it is a very interesting thing what the movie was talking about, about the impact of advertising on social media and how basically our psychologies are used against us and how they said the quote, “If you’re not paying for the product, then you are the product”. And I think that’s fascinating business model. It’s a business model.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: And the product is the the very minute changes that we take in our behaviors and how the advertisers, subtly and frankly, manipulatively change what we do, what we think, how we act and our behaviours are being tracked. They’re seeing how long we’re looking at things, at what time, where we go next. And, you know, all of this data is basically congregated and used to influence us and predict our behavior.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: I was thinking that because when Jaron Lanier was speaking, he had said something like, it’s about the “gradual, slight, imperceptible change in our own behavior and perception that is the product” and I had to read that a few times because I was like, “Yeah, it is so true”.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: It’s about the gradual change like you’re talking about. It’s not like this huge change that happens so quickly. That’s what you were talking about earlier, about having the psychology behind it, because what’s going to hook? What’s going to make you stay on that device a little bit longer?
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Totally. And that those are tailored based on your past behavior? So, I mean, it’s very intelligent, but very scary. And what I didn’t know that Social Dilemma talked about, which just was fascinating, but again, frightening, is that if you put something in a Google search, it will automatically fill. You know, how you start typing in a Google search and it auto fills several different things that that autofill will be different depending on where you live and the history of what you’ve done on the internet. Like for one person, it will type in, if you start writing climate change, it’ll say climate change is a hoax. Whereas for someone else, it’ll say climate change is real. And I mean, that is fascinating.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: When you say that, it’s so funny, because we watched this movie separately. We haven’t had a discussion yet until right now. And literally your talking points are right on where I was. My mind was blown from that. And of course, my oldest daughter was kind of laughing because I had no idea. I’m like, “Did you know that when you do a Google search, it’s about the location that you live, the area in which you live, and also, they tracked your history?” You know, so this huge data. And she’s like, “Um HMM”.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: She knew that?
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Well, I don’t know if she knew that or if she just did not care. You know, I was laughing because afterwards…there was three of us watching the movie and then my 13 year old kind of joined in, too. And it was so fun to talk about it afterwards with them because I was gung ho. I was like, “I’m so passionate. I feel this now. I want to do something to bring change”, you know, all the way down to the end of the spectrum, that was like, “Yeah, that’s good. OK, I got to go. I got to do some Snapchats. I got to go, Mom, got work to be done here”. So I was like, “Did we miss something here?” And that’s the whole point, right. You know, my take away really was like, how will this movie, if at all, change behavior? That was the question. I kind of walked away with that. That was my one questions. How will this change behavior? For some it might and for others it might not.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Well, and I think it’s about. Just knowledge. Like for me personally, it was so fascinating, and yet I still plan on using social media. I still see the benefits to it, you know, on a personal level, connecting with friends, on a business level finding like minded communities and, you know, people who can benefit from, you know, different like minded community groups such as Sandwich Generation Squeeze. Which, you know, just to put a little plug in, we have our own Facebook group that we’d love to have you in. But again, I think it’s just knowing your limits, you know, like don’t find our group and spend 30 hours, you know, on it in a row. Check in once every couple of days. You know, don’t whatever happens on there, don’t let it affect your mood for the rest of the day. And so I think it’s it’s knowing the pros and cons of it, still being able to use it, but having kind of a check and balance for not getting addicted and kind of peeling back the layers.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: So you’re aware of what’s going on behind the scenes. So you’re not being manipulated by it.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Absolutely. And you know, and I think, too, in terms of like, how does this impact Sandwich Generation Squeeze? It impacts it a lot, too, right?
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Because there are so many huge benefits of social media for people to have awareness of what’s going on, to feel support, to feel collaboration with others who might be going through similar things.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: But then there is also the flip side of that, where, again, like we talked about, is that sometimes it’s such an escape that is it taking away time for us really living in the moment. And, you know, I think that’s what was pretty beautiful at the end of the movie, too, is about, you know, at what point can we balance that?
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: At what point can we say, yeah, these are the benefits, but right now I’m going to put this away so I can go out and take a walk or call up my aunt, who I haven’t talked to in a while or whatever it might be.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Yeah, exactly. I mean, and, you know, the escape can be a positive too you know, especially during times of stress or if you’re knee deep in the sandwich generation squeeze and things are hard, it’s fine. I think to get an escape on social media. It’s fine to go on and connect with a friend on there. But just like you say, just know the limits. Set a timer. Be aware that people often don’t post their real lives on social media, so don’t kind of compare yourself to that.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: And that’s hard not to.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: It sure is. It sure is. But, you know, to just kind of have those checkpoints so you can use it in productive ways, but then be able to put it down and walk away.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Absolutely. And I’m not sure, I can’t recall her name, but it was a doctor that was on there from Stanford University. She was talking about the pleasure pain balance and the dopamine deficit states and all of that.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: But even her own children, you know, again, it kind of goes back when the creators were talking about how they can kind of get hooked. It’s about the balance. So that’s kind of what we wanted to kind of talk about. Bring to everybody today. Hopefully, people will tune in and check out the movie and see what you think.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Totally, it is a great movie and this is such a fun conversation, I think such an important one. Thank you as always for listening. The Sandwich Generation Squeeze. We hope that you share us with your friends.
Cris Roskelley, LMFT: And it would also be great if you would rate and review our show on Apple podcast, which will help new listeners find us. And if you’d like to submit a question for our halftime show or suggest a future topic, just head on over to our website at sandwichgenerationsqueeze.com. Bye for now.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: Bye!
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Cris Roskelley, LMFT: Which is so helpful during the sandwich generation squeeze, right? When there’s so many different family members trying to coordinate care and really can help you stay organized across devices where anyone in the family or in the caregiving team can access the shared calendar, get reminders and see lists from any computer or on any mobile device. And Cozi even offers a color-coded calendar and to do list, shopping list, recipes and a family journal.
Dianne Kraaijvanger, PsyD: So to get a special promo for our squeezers, just follow the link in our show notes to let Cozi know that we sent you in to help support our show.